User talk:Ngng

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Revision as of 16:45, 29 December 2015 by Ryudo (talk | contribs) (PAL Serial remove reason: new section)
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Previously on the air

What to do on the wiki

This link has some info on what is planned to be done on the wiki.

New Template

I have put up some updates about the plan for a new template on my user page. Please give it a look. Tonygiang (talk) 05:47, 21 July 2014 (BST)

This is not the first attempt to update the template (as you can also see on my page here). When it was created I was torn between "the last tested configuration" template and "the table of all tested configurations" template. It just happened that "the last tested configuration" template was implemented before and was never changed afterwards. The idea was that there aren't so many users to contribute so the one configuration is enough in most cases (especially for some forgotten and rare games) plus the table template would be way more complex for an ordinary user to work with. And finally I've run into the serious lack of time IRL (the state I'm currently in btw).
It's not that easy to update the current template correctly as you can see here it's rather a complex thing. If you're serious about changing it you should make a working test page beforehand (you can use your own user page for that or even create a new test page). Finally I can find some time and help you turn your test page into the new template (if you want my help). And only when we will have the new beautiful working page we can update every game page in existence (and this would also be a hard work because there are so many pages to update).
By the way do you really think that "the table of all tested configurations" template will improve the data collection on the wiki? It will be more readable no doubt about it but I haven't witnessed that many cases of updating or replacing the outdated info. There were some but not so many. And many of those just updated the version to the latest available. The useful thing about this table template is when there is a regression in development leads to broken games you would be able to see it and choose not to use that "bad" version to play the game. But other than that the older entries in this table are for historical or sentimental reasons, IMO. What's your take on this? --Ngng (talk) 07:38, 21 July 2014 (BST)
I could see that was the problem early on, and unfortunately, the single-test case format just creates a mentality of hesitation for newer testers. I used to be one, wondering whether or not I should overwrite the test result of another user when I didn't reproduce the same issue(s) on a different hardware configuration, different OS and different plugins. You know, it's not just replacing outdated testing results (in which case, 1 test case would be enough indeed), but providing various results on varying testing environments as well. I do think rearranging the template to allow multiple test cases will not only improve data collection, but encourage contribution as well.
I have looked into how the Dolphin guys made the testing table for their wiki, which seems adaptable if there's no quirk in either wiki. You can see here that they actually used a combination of 3 separate templates to build the table:
{{testing/start}}
<!--Use this template for test entries: {{testing/entry|revision=|OS=|CPU=|GPU=|result=|tester=}}-->
{{testing/end}}
The documentation can explain itself well enough. It's actually a very ad-hoc method considering their testing/end template simply contains a markup wrap. Their testing/entry template is the glue (and the most intimidating part) of this format, but I'm sure we can adapt this eventually. Tonygiang (talk) 13:02, 21 July 2014 (BST)
Well, lets try to do it then! We can remove some parts from the old template and use the new one alongside with it. This approach from Dolphin guys seems reasonable and easy enough to use so we can adopt it without copying their actual template (it's not so complex anyway). First of all we need to agree on the table columns. A you can see here there was an attempt to do it about two years ago so we can at least take this into consideration. Try creating your own table (without using any templates for the time being) and I'll convert it to templates when we're agreed on its contents. By the way I'll be out of town for 3 days until the end of the week (starting tomorrow) so I won't be able to answer you for some time. --Ngng (talk) 06:06, 22 July 2014 (BST)
A sample table is up on my user page. Tonygiang (talk) 10:23, 22 July 2014 (BST)
I made my own sample on my user page. I used a different table style so it's more compact and has "wiki" colors. I changed the "Sound" row to "CDVD" because I thought knowing what CDVD plugin someone used would be more helpful. I also changed "Comments" to "Speedhacks", because otherwise every test result would just be repeating each other saying things like "audio is desynched".
IMO any comments about issues with the game or comments about what gamefixes to use shouldn't be stated in the table. That way it is more convenient for people that look for these 2 things in the wiki:
  • Whether a game is playable or not.
  • What settings should I use to fix specific issues.
Other people interested in performance of the game will look at the table to see if they can run the game at full speed.
Also more info about "wiki tables" can be found here and here.
--Shunter (talk) 12:43, 22 July 2014 (GMT-5)
The style looks nicer, although it could use a border-collapse style to save some screen space real estate. The sample comment about the issues of the games are just examples of what the testers would have a say on, not what they are obligated to repeat in every entry. They could have some comment about the performance of particular hardware, how far they could push the game above standard testing condition (which is always native resolution and no graphical enhancement), etc... Like you said, it's a performance reference table, but we can only make it so with some space for the testers to tell us about the performance they got, don't we?
I don't think speedhacks need a separate column since as the devs said, test results are assumed to have no kind of hacks enabled (because technically, they are hack-ey by default and could mangle test results, hence not very useful for the devs to look at). Mentioning of speedhacks is only necessary if they generate different results. My terrible example entry did not reflect those things very well and might have given you an impression that speedhacks need to be explicit for every entry. That one example alone should in no way be the guideline to make test entries.
I have no clue about a CDVD plugin column. Are CDVD plugins really complicated to configure or lacking in compatibility that users would find it helpful to have it explicit? Tonygiang (talk) 10:20, 24 July 2014 (BST)
Some games run worse when you try to run them using the disc, so it might be helpful to know whether the tester used an ISO or ran the game through the DVD drive. Although I now think that instead of a CDVD column, that space could be used for something else.

--Shunter (talk) 7:14, 24 July 2014 (GMT-5)


I'm also in favor of having the comments (or result) column because otherwise there are no means of telling whether the game is working or not using this config (we can even color the table cell or the whole line in some light green/red/blue to reflect the result). Any relevant info (like bios, hacks, fps etc.) can also be stored in it. But what about regions (PAL/NTSC(-J))? The games from the different regions may have considerable difference in performance and behavior. --Ngng (talk) 08:08, 25 July 2014 (BST)

Can't we make separate pages for each regional version of the same game, then? That was how the public compatbility list is organized. Several games even have different names in each regions. If not, then the CPU/GPU info could go into the same column, so that there would be 3 factors in environment: os, hardware and region. Tonygiang (talk) 07:45, 26 July 2014 (BST)
Having a number of pages for one game is really not a wise thing to do. We won't even be able to name the pages right (this is ugly: "Fatal Frame NTSC-U", "Fatal Frame PAL", "Fatal Frame NTSC-J") and this will spawn so many duplicates. Besides we'd have to copy most of the issues to all the pages and maintain these pages simultaneously. I can think of a number of additional problems we would face if we'll adopt this approach... --Ngng (talk) 06:32, 27 July 2014 (BST)
I updated my sample table. To match what you guys wanted.

--Shunter (talk) 2:03, 26 July 2014 (GMT-5)

Okay now your tables look very much alike (except for minor differences). I'll dust off my wiki markup knowledge then and make the sample template. --Ngng (talk) 06:32, 27 July 2014 (BST)

I've made three templates: Template:TestingHeader, Template:TestingFooter and Template:TestingEntry (the later has some info about its usage). If you have any ideas just go ahead and edit the templates (we can always revert to any version). --Ngng (talk) 09:18, 27 July 2014 (BST)

I'm really clueless when it comes to wiki templates, but is it possible to have 2 parameters in the same cell? So that the CPU/GPU column can automatically sort them into list? Tonygiang (talk) 13:52, 28 July 2014 (BST)
I think this is the way it's done right now (if I understand you correctly). What really concerns me is how this will look on the games' pages because without any other info and only two tables on the page (game card table on the right pane and this testing table in the middle) it may really look ugly :-\.
What do you think, should we proceed now or should we wait for any other opinions on the testing table (because it will be harder to change it later)? --Ngng (talk) 06:28, 29 July 2014 (BST)
This is what a game page looks like now: http://i.imgur.com/CNov8Qt.jpg
This is what a game page can look like with a table: http://i.imgur.com/YfICe8v.jpg
I used an image editor to make the second image but if you can make the new template look like that, it won't look as ugly. Maybe we should make a post on the PCSX2 forums to get more opinions?

--Shunter (talk) 1:43, 29 July 2014 (GMT-5)

Impressive work, thank you! But I was more concerned about really empty pages save for the test info (without issues and reviews and anything at all). Btw, do you think we should separate test tables on the OS basis?
I'll make the post on the forums and then proceed to apply changes to the old template in a couple of days. --Ngng (talk) 10:41, 30 July 2014 (BST)

New Template (cont.)

What you guys have got so far looks good to me. The only thing I would mention is the lack of a section for input plugins, as I know at least a handful of games require a special configuration of lilypad or a different plugin altogether. I suppose that could go in the comments column though. Good work! --Blyss Sarania

@Ngng I think we should make a separate table for different OSs; I made a separate table for both OSs because it ended up looking better.

--Shunter (talk) 12:27, 30 July 2014 (GMT-5)

Finally managed to get back. Anyway, I don't see why we would need separate table for each OS. Didn't we have a dedicated column for OS already? --Tonygiang (talk) 10:03, 31 July 2014 (BST)
The only thing I would suggest would be a way for someone to add their own comments for unreproducible issues and the like instead of editing the main article, I'm not saying it is needed, but it would be nice. Clank (talk) 02:59, 31 July 2014 (BST)

Sorry, guys, it's been a horribly busy and generally horrible week for me...
On the topic of separate tables: I'd say lets try and separate them (we can always go back to one table it's not that hard). This way it will look a bit better IMO with the OS icons and big headers and the dedicated column will still be used to show OS version.
@Clank: If I understand you correctly you want a special place (column or such) for encountered issues in the test table... I think we have no place left. You can always use comments for anything issue related or you may add them to the main article (to be honest there is a way -- we can use an extra line with merged columns solely for the purpose of registering issues, but it may look pretty bad, idk)
@Blyss Sarania: I think comments will do for the time being, although the time will tell.
I'm gonna make a long time overdue "issue template" today. Should we wait a bit more or should I proceed with the test table? --Ngng (talk) 10:13, 2 August 2014 (BST)

I really like the idea of the new issue template, but I have a question. Is the issue "Fixed" if there's a workaround for it, or can we only mark as "Fixed" if the PCSX2 team makes a fix for the game?
I think we should proceed with the test table, since no one is objecting.

--Shunter (talk) 7:27, 2 August 2014 (GMT-5)

IMO I it should be marked as fixed when it's no longer manifesting itself under the given conditions (for example the minor GFX glitch is gone in GDSX HW because devs fixed it). Otherwise most of the issues will be marked as fixed because they have workarounds. And with all that said I'll proceed with the test table (although I'll better do it tomorrow in the morning when there's a certain itch to do things ;-) ). --Ngng (talk) 14:11, 2 August 2014 (BST)

Update: I've altered issue type so we can add "notes". When the game does not run smoothly without some option activated it's still worth noting somewhere but it's not an issue (if the option is not a hack of course). It least this system is more flexible now.
I can't start working on test tables until I'm finished with updating issues on all game pages. I only hope there aren't so many left... --Ngng (talk) 09:58, 3 August 2014 (BST)

There was a way to apply a category to the whole game list, wasn't there? You could do that right now and roll out the new stub template so that we can gradually convert the pages later. It gives something to generate new stubs from the forum's compatibility list, too.
I'm not keen on the whole separate table for each OS thing. Pcsx2 might be ported to other platforms other than Windows and Linux in the future, then we'd have to make another tweak to the stub template for each new platform. One-size-fits-all table is future-proof, but if i'm out-voted in the matter, got to roll along, I guess. --Tonygiang (talk) 08:59, 5 August 2014 (BST)
I'm almost done with the issues, just a couple of pages of indexed games left. I just don't want to mix these two problems. I understand your concern about table separation. It will be really easy to go back to one table if it will turn out not be as good I promise. --Ngng (talk) 09:41, 5 August 2014 (BST)

New Template (cont.2)

So it's been done. See this page for reference. I don't know what to think about it atm because I need a fresh look (tomorrow), but the first impression is so-so... Maybe it will change tomorrow idk. Please comment and try to convert other pages to see the difference. To convert the page you have to:

  • remove the word game in the line {{infobox game
  • remove the lines starting with <!-- Windows specs --> until the end of template. The last removed line must start with pccomment=
  • add testing tables in a form (using the removed values):
{{TestingHeader|OS=Windows}}
{{TestingEntry
|Status=?
|Region=?
|OS=?
|CPU=?
|GPU=?
|Revision=?
|Graphics=?
|Sound=?
|Comments=?
|Tester=?
}}
...
{{TestingFooter}}

I'm done for today, see you tomorrow... --Ngng (talk) 20:38, 6 August 2014 (BST)

I just updated this page to the new template. IMO it looks alright but the template could use some tweaks. For example, the text in the boxes should be centered. Also the table needs more room width-wise. Is it possible to decrease the width of the "infobox" to increase the width of the tables?
--Shunter (talk) 5:42, 6 August 2014 (GMT-5)
I have a really simple resolution for that: put the testing table at the bottom, below the Known Issues section. That way, it doesn't share page width with the infobox. I've edited the Drakan page as an example. Seems ok for now. --Tonygiang (talk) 06:42, 8 August 2014 (BST)

Sorry guys, I've been swamped again (as always)...
@SHunter: At my 1920x1080 resolution the problem with space deficit is non-existent. :) The table scales automatically right now, but some columns (in fact all but the last one) have fixed width so it may look pretty ugly for some resolutions. I'll try to tune it somehow so to beautify it for smaller monitors... Try to play with column align yourself (IMO this one is alright, but why not try to center to see the difference?). Fiddle with the right panel also. It's mostly defined in the same template.
@Tonygiang: Putting the table after all the info will only work in case we have this info. See for example this page. The table looks fine if it's not swarmed with info like it was with Drakan in my case. --Ngng (talk) 19:03, 8 August 2014 (BST)

I'd say I like it now... Maybe I like it even better than the plain info. I hope it's not too late for that anyway (PCSX2 development is kind of slow for the last 3-4 years, will there be enough "versions" to make use of our new test table)...
To the matter at hand: we can "easily" convert all the empty pages ("easily" being overstatement here) but I believe the amount of work to convert the filled pages is monstrous. To convert the page we have to open its history first and get the tester name. In case there was a previous test info we should go back in time to find it and add this old info to the table as well. Some pages will require a lot of time to transfer and it cannot be done automatically. :(
Old template pages category will show all the pages with the old template (right now it's empty but it should update itself (I hope) if some kind of scheduler runs on PCSX2 server. If it will stay empty it's not a big deal. As a last resort I can ask Bositman to run some wiki related scripts, idk).
I can try to speed up the whole thing by making use of these buttons


I think I'll try it tomorrow, at least we can do it in semi-automatic fashion. --Ngng (talk) 19:51, 8 August 2014 (BST)

http://wiki.pcsx2.net/index.php?action=edit&preload=TempPageForTemplateTransfer&section=new&title=Sega+Superstars+Tennis: this URL will do the same with Sega Superstars Tennis as the button above. I'll exploit PUT method by creating batch file to open edit and history pages for multiple games at once. This method will allow us to speed up edits without wasting time on searching pages... --Ngng (talk) 20:09, 8 August 2014 (BST)


New Template (cont.3)

I've decided to create more universal solution and to write an external utility to convert the old template into the new one (to an extent of course) using clipboard. Basically you have to start the program leave it running while working on pages conversion. Press Alt-Shift-E on a chosen page (it's a shortcut for editing), use Ctrl-A to select all text and Ctrl-C to put it into clipboard. After that you just have to press Shift-Shift (left shift and right shift concurrently) and the program will convert (or try to convert) the text automatically. Get the text from clipboard again (Ctrl-V) and check the result, correct it, add needed info and the tester name (from page history). I've spent the whole day doing some automation stuff for the wiki (and I'm not done yet) and this utility, although may feel like magic to me, could still use some improvement and may also contain a number of bugs. Please test it and leave some feedback. Thanks.
I cannot upload binary files on the wiki pages so I'll do it in this thread. --Ngng (talk) 19:52, 9 August 2014 (BST)

I'm preparing to convert most of the empty pages (and only empty pages) automatically but they would look really empty without any info. What do you think is better to leave them bare like this or put a placeholder table like this? --Ngng (talk) 11:21, 10 August 2014 (BST)

Leave a table, it gives potential testers an idea what goes where. --Tonygiang (talk) 10:11, 11 August 2014 (BST)


Correcting and completing the machine conversions (COMPLETED, no longer needed)

This is a small note on how to correct the auto-converted pages into their finished state (in case you have some time and want to help):

  1. First of all you need to choose a page to correct from this category.
  2. Start editing the page and open the page history simultaneously.
  3. Search through the history (using prev links) and find the author of the last configuration change.
  4. Copy authors name into Tester field
  5. Fill OS field if possible (some comments may contain it)
  6. Fill Status field (0,1 or 2)
  7. Fill Region field if possible (some comments may contain it)
  8. If the older records in history contain previous test information (which was exchanged for the current by the mentioned author), you should add another test case and fill it as well.
  9. If all goes well, remove [[Category:Temp - unverified automatically converted pages]] line from the article and save it
  10. Minus one unfinished article, thank you!


This is a slow process so it will take some time until all these articles are corrected. --Ngng (talk) 10:37, 14 August 2014 (BST)

Congrats on converting every page to the new template. I just wish I could've helped out more but I didn't have the time. -Shunter 12:02, 20 October 2014 (GMT-5)

You still helped a lot with the conversion (and with the template itself) so thank you! And I'm also grateful for putting in a word for me to Bositman! I guess I'd make that blog post about wiki in general and maybe to call out for someone who could re-design the main page and improve the overall look of game articles a little. We'll see what he thinks about it. --Ngng (talk) 07:03, 21 October 2014 (BST)

What is Pokopom?

http://forums.pcsx2.net/Thread-Pokopom-KrossX-s-Pad-Plugin Not sure if it should be added to the wiki but it's an "open source XInput input plugin for PSX emulators, PCSX2, nullDC 1.0.4, Chankast 0.25 and many N64 emulators."

A great alternative to other input plugins, I never used it much though.

And now you know :D

Thanks for the info. :) Now I know... --Ngng (talk) 07:33, 24 August 2014 (BST)

Navbox

Just a test for navbox from Wikipedia...


If anyone has any ideas about this template, please drop a message here. The bottom part of the template is possibly broken right now (Wikipedia uses LUA-driven templates now and we do not have LUA (and honestly we don't need it) so the thing I've stolen from them was not up-to-date). I'll correct it later.

Some partially hidden text experiments

Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test
This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test Just a test This is a test Still a simple test End of this test



Winlogo.png Test configurations on Windows:


Environment Configurations Comments Tester
Region OS CPU/GPU Revision Graphics Sound/Pad
NTSC-U ?
  • Intel(R) Core(TM) i5 CPU M 430 @ 2.27GHz
  • NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M (8.17.12.9551)
0.9.9.r5128 (svn) GSDx r5135 0.1.16
  • SPU2-X r5139 2.0.0
  • Lilypad r5112 0.11.0
BIOS: USA 1.60, FPS:~50-60, The use of dense fog in this game results in an uneven framerate (with frame skip disabled); Running fullscreen D3D10 mode, 2x native scaling with custom window ...
size 1168x1022 on a 1080p TV. Dynamic vsync off. Interpolation #4, de-alias filter, Xaudio 2, latency 90ms, Timestretch w/ default settings. Disc is an ISO on HDD. Playing with Dualshock 3 using libUSB/sixaxis64. FMVs won't play normally with scaled resolution and HW rendering. In other words, hit F9 when movies start :). Sound is a little wobbly in FMVs in software mode, but not unlistenable.
Quaestor

What do you think? Is it an interesting/useful feature (considering that these walls of text look really bad on small monitors (I can see it by reducing the width of my FF window)). --Ngng (talk) 16:17, 2 November 2014 (UTC)



Hey that's pretty awesome. It would definitely make the pages more clean looking.

Ryudo (talk) 16:56, 2 November 2014 (UTC)


Well I guess I'll try that on the real pages than! --Ngng (talk) 18:37, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
Some weird behavior I'm going to deal with tomorrow:

• There is a shaking problem in game, but it can be fixed by choosing blend bff interlace mode in gsdx. • You need a pretty fast cpu in order to run the game nicely without speedhack since speedhacks don't improve much for the game.


Hmm, it might be better if you simply make the collapse/expand thing appear when it's longer than 3 lines maybe and then start the rest on a new line. And then without the whole "..." as well.

So you'd get

AAAA BBBB CCCC DDDD EEEE FFFF GGGG HHHH IIII JJJJ KKKK LLLL MMMM NNNN
AAAA BBBB CCCC DDDD EEEE FFFF GGGG HHHH IIII JJJJ KKKK LLLL MMMM NNNN
AAAA BBBB CCCC DDDD EEEE FFFF GGGG HHHH IIII JJJJ KKKK LLLL MMMM NNNN
[Expand] / [Collapse]
OOOO PPPP QQQQ RRRR SSSS TTTT UUUU VVVV WWWW XXXX YYYY ZZZZ
OOOO PPPP QQQQ RRRR SSSS TTTT UUUU VVVV WWWW XXXX YYYY ZZZZ
OOOO PPPP QQQQ RRRR SSSS TTTT UUUU VVVV WWWW XXXX YYYY ZZZZ
OOOO PPPP QQQQ RRRR SSSS TTTT UUUU VVVV WWWW XXXX YYYY ZZZZ

Because right now it would basically cut it off at GG.. and then start ..GG on the next line in the expand window. This looks weird to me. You think it's possible to do it with the way I described? (Not sure if you're still working on this, disregard this message if you are).

Ryudo (talk) 09:24, 4 November 2014 (UTC)

My problem is I have only very basic knowledge on CSS/Java script and Wikipedia does not have any tool, script or template that can do proper collapse/expand. If you'd ever come across some wiki with good collapse/expand examples we could use it here. Then again, in time I think I'll get to the level required to write the script myself. But right now it looks pretty ugly... --Ngng (talk) 09:47, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
Yeah, I see what you mean. I'm looking into it as well atm. See here on my user page for some experiments. Didn't wanna clutter up your page so I did it on mine instead. :P
Ryudo (talk) 11:52, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
Unfortunately, built-in Wikimedia class mw-collapsible is far from ideal (and it doesn't work with bullets and numbers). The end user will only provide the text, he will not specify the point where this text should collapse. The script then should determine this point and I can't find the solution to this using the tools I know (whether it's the solid text block or the text contains many lines). Heck, I can't even remove 0xA 0xD symbols from the line to make it a solid block! I can't even find the position of those line-breaks in the text!
There is another solution, though. If the text is big enough we can just hide it altogether like this:
Comments (expand to see):

BIOS: USA v02.30.

Runs great, even at 2560x1440 resolution. (Constant 60 FPS) I've had no issues playing this game. The only problematic area was only due to a controller issue, which is the Barr Mountains area where you had to play the Dragon Flute. This was already a horrendous area even on the actual PS2. But using the workaround I was able to pass this area just fine.
But I do not know if it will be any better than cutting the sentence in half in some random place. --Ngng (talk) 12:15, 4 November 2014 (UTC)

Some partially hidden text experiments (part 2)

BIOS: USA v02.30. Runs great, even at 2560x1440 resolution. (Constant 60 FPS) I've had no issues playing this game. The only problematic area was only due to a controller issue, which is the Barr Mountains area where you had to play the Dragon Flute. This was already a horrendous area even on the actual PS2. But using the workaround I was able to pass this area just fine.

It seems javascript is not that hard to crack after all. At least this task wasn't impossible to do without prior javascript knowledge... --Ngng (talk) 16:07, 4 November 2014 (UTC)

Navboxes on the march

In order to improve cross-linking between game pages we need to create a number (more than 250) navboxes. Creating and filling a navbox is a time-consuming task so it will take a while to finish them all. Anyone wants to help a little here's a category. All of these entries are games from game series that could use a navbox. If you don't know how to handle a navbox, please don't bother, because it will also take a while to explain it in full. :) Otherwise thanks in advance for any help. --Ngng (talk) 16:20, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

Basically, you need to copy the new template from wikipedia, remove any groups that aren't games related (video, characters, etc...), add the last group "related" (and fill it with all the PS2 developers of the game series) and change non-PS2 links back to wikipedia (so * ''[[Dragon Ball: Advanced Adventure|Advanced Adventure]]'' will become * ''[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Ball:_Advanced_Adventure Advanced Adventure]'' (GBA)). Add the link to your new template on all affected game pages and you're done. --Ngng (talk) 10:22, 15 November 2014 (UTC)

Screenshots

Hey I posted this on the Forums as well, but I'm not sure if you're as active there as you are on here :P Sandbox for Screenshots If you look at the bottom of that page, you'll notice I added a gallery/screenshots section. Do you think it'd be a good idea to add this to pages we have screens for? Ryudo (talk) 17:42, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

I think it's a good idea for pages that have excessive amount of screenshots. And currently I know only one game page that fits this description... :)
But we already have a number of games with screenshots. --Ngng (talk) 18:18, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

Publishers

Heya, do you think it's possible to add 'Publishers' to the infobox table of the game pages? The reason for this is that there are a lot of games that have an unknown developer but a wellknown publisher instead. An example of this is Naruto: Ultimate Ninja for example. In this case CyberConnect2 developed it in Japan, but it's most known to be released by Namco in USA/Europe, which makes a lot more sense for the average Joe accessing the Wiki here. If I look up an NTSC or PAL game, I always look for the publisher instead of the developer, because that's a lot easier to find than the developer.

We can probably just put Publishers right below the Developer area. So it would look like this:

Developer: [[Name]]
Publisher: [[Name]]

Ryudo (talk) 09:38, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

The original idea behind having only developers was that publishers do not "develop" games so they aren't that useful while searching. In other words you'll either search for a developer if you already played another game from them (ex. Team Silent / Team Ico) or for the games within the same franchise (ex. Final Fantasy). Besides I thought you can always add a notable publisher in the developer field, no probs.
Having said that, I think we can add the publisher, but as of now none of the game articles contain them; and it would require quite an effort to fill them all. It's pretty easy for me to add this field, but will it be worth it? What do you think? --Ngng (talk) 17:36, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
Hmm in my opinion I think it will be worth it, especially with games where the publisher is better known than the actual developer of a game. And sure it's a little bit of effort to add publishers, but we can just gradually work on updating those things. Eventually I'll be updating my own test entries anyways, and then I can already adjust those pages, the rest will come in time. -- Ryudo (talk) 22:15, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
Okay, I added publisher field but it will not spawn additional categories like "Games by XXXX" atm. And I do not know whether it should. --06:57, 1 December 2014 (UTC)
Awesome, thanks! -- Ryudo (talk) 09:06, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

Info transfer Forum -> Wiki

Sorry guys but when my robot commits changes (80 pages per run) the wiki may become slow... unbearably slow!.. There's nothing I can do about it :( (although I could do it in different time I guess). Please bear with me these 2-5 days of commits before I'll finish this stage. Thanks! --Ngng (talk) 18:15, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Public compatibility forum links

Hey ng, can you take a look at these please and tell us what you think in the topic?

Link

They're potential new logos maybe if you like them. There's a bunch of them posted so tell me if you like 'em and which one you like most if you do. -- Ryudo (talk) 23:04, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

They are pretty good! Let's try the last one. We'll see how it will look... --Ngng (talk) 06:50, 3 December 2014 (UTC)
Thanks! Is there a place we can preview how it looks on the Wiki with the logo updated? Right now the old logo still displays -- Ryudo (talk) 19:40, 3 December 2014 (UTC)
I've changed the logo, I guess it will take some time until the cache is purged (at least it is my hope). Then again I've only changed it once on the very old version of MediaWiki, maybe it should be changed differently now, idk. Let's wait until tomorrow, if the old logo stays I'll try to do something else. --Ngng (talk) 19:48, 3 December 2014 (UTC)
If you're wondering, I'm waiting for the answer from Bositman. It's possible that some settings on the server side link the real logo image with some other file I have no access to. --Ngng (talk) 15:22, 4 December 2014 (UTC)
Yeah it most likely needs to be overwritten on the server itself. aka via FTP. Notice how that element is background-image: url("/skins/common/images/mywiki.png"); So the file mywiki.png needs to be overwritten via FTP upload. -- Ryudo (talk) 21:21, 4 December 2014 (UTC)
Yep, I know it has a different name. It's supposed to be updated from Wiki.png in some work queue or such (I've never fiddled with media wiki on the server side, -- never had a need to do it, I've only set up Joomla). Let's just wait for Bositman. --Ngng (talk) 06:07, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

Bositman told me that they want to create consistency thought all PCSX2 sites, meaning they will use new logo everywhere including the wiki. I think that is appropriate. Too many symbols and logos do not make a sound impression. Tough luck for your logo. Sorry. --Ngng (talk) 16:53, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

Well that sucks :/ Which sites is he talking about though? He means the main site I guess? -- Ryudo (talk) 18:02, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

The main site the forums and the wiki in my understanding. But I think it doesn't suck. IMO it's high time they change forums logo. It's old and ugly just like the main page here on the wiki. :-\ And any changes to the logo in one place should be reflected everywhere. Just cheer up, it's only a logo after all. --Ngng (talk) 18:16, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
Al least they should let us try to take the background out of the logo here, in all honesty, that skyblue square doesn't look too good. I'm gonna be a bit short of time on the following days, but I'm gonna try to vector the "PSCX2" and replicate the gradients when I have time. DoctorMuerte (talk) 19:06, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
Well the thing is they will change this square into something else, it's not that they try to stick with this old dusty blue logo forever. You can PM Bositman yourself and ask him about it. It's easy!
On the side note I'm gonna have a vacation near the end of next week (and I feel happy about it!), but I will be unable to watch over this place for two weeks. I hope I'll copy all the forum test cases before this time because I really hate to leave something unfinished. --Ngng (talk) 19:45, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
Ok, I'll ask him, perhaps we should wait until they do it.DoctorMuerte (talk) 21:31, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
What I don't get is that he doesn't want to change it because he wants it to be the same everywhere... when the truth is that it's not even the case now either. The Forums, Site, and Wiki all use different logos. The only ones that look similar are the forum and main site, the wiki is completely different. I get the idea behind wanting it to be the same everywhere, but it's not even being applied right now. (Not to mention that the PCSX2 app has a different logo from the site and forum too). Is there some plan for a massive update to the logos coming up soon? If there's no plans for such update then I see no reason NOT to change the wiki logo at least, because it's already different from every site as it is.

Ah well, doesn't matter anymore. If he chooses to use it still later on he's free to do so. Ryudo (talk) 23:29, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

Ah, come on, don't be so sore about it. It's only a picture. I think he plans to update all logos everywhere. Here's his original message: "The problem is we can't have 6 different logos all around, we need to have some brand image that people recognize. I am already using a new logo for the website update that will happen soon, but we need to all decide which will be used officially..." --Ngng (talk) 05:54, 6 December 2014 (UTC)
Indeed we don't have the same logo everywhere now either and that is something I am looking to fix with the site update as an excuse. We have logos on the program, the website, the wiki, the forum, the youtube channel, twitter account and google+ and there is inconsistency all over the place. I do appreciate all the work you guys have done around here and hate for it to go to waste, but having a distinct brand image will help PCSX2 get more well known IMO. I need to have a talk with any active team members still around to decide what logo we will be using cross-site, then you guys can customize it for the wiki so at least it looks uniform. Bositman (talk) 15:26, 6 December 2014 (UTC)

Images transfer is finished

Yay! I finished images transfer. Took me longer than I anticipated with all the small errors I'm prone to (like broken or skipped images) but it's finally done. Test cases will wait until I'll be beack from vacation, but it was important for me to finish at least what I've started. --Ngng (talk) 10:51, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

Nice job, enjoy your holidays. DoctorMuerte (talk) 00:50, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
Always the best, happy holidays! CloudUchiha (talk) 15:39, 11 December 2014 (UTC)
Welcome back mate, nice to see you again. DoctorMuerte (talk) 23:28, 25 December 2014 (UTC)
Thanks! It feels that 2 weeks ain't a long time when it comes to holidays. :) --Ngng (talk) 05:29, 26 December 2014 (UTC)
I know, 2 weeks is a short period when you're in holydays. Whenever you have time, please take a look at this list. DoctorMuerte (talk) 23:52, 27 December 2014 (UTC)
You mean Hotkeys and Commandline support? They look nice (I for one didn't know it was possible to launch PS2 games from Steam client). I'll definitely read them to check grammar when I'll finish with test3. When it comes to the Linux guide I can only read it through because I'm not a Linux guy I know very little about it. I could not event help you with screen shots for this guide (you still have Windows screen shots in it). It will take someone who actually live in Linux to help with this guide.
I think we need a navbox for all special and guide-related pages. I'll make it a bit later.
New main page proposal is a controversial topic. Some of your elements do look refreshing but all in all it's still the same page (I got really tired of seeing those four controllers for all those years). Take a look at Dolphin's wiki page. It's not ideal I know but it's simpler and easier on the eye. Besides, who would constantly update Latest news & blog entries when you (and me) will eventually cease to be active here? So this topic will require some additional thoughts. --Ngng (talk) 06:23, 28 December 2014 (UTC)
I'm glad you like the new guides. I'm gonna update the pictures on the linux guide (I have a linux distro installed aswell).
About the new main page, I agree we need more ideas on how to do it. DoctorMuerte (talk) 10:39, 28 December 2014 (UTC)

Test cases transfer

In the following days I'm going to attempt to transfer all useful test cases from the forum. After that I'll be free to do anything else (meaning I'll continue with checking the Windows guide). --Ngng (talk) 15:47, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

Forum user test:

More Tags

I think adding more tags will make the wiki even more useful and organized.

Tags I would really like to see for game articles:

  • Supports native progressive scan
  • Supports 16:9 aspect ratio
  • Games that have widescreen patches
  • Games that don't widescreens (Any game article that don't have either of the 2 tags above will receive this tag)

The following links will help determine which game articles will receive those tags:

Also I think stubs need to be separated from game articles that have no test cases (if they aren't already).

Funny, just recently I thought about marking those games that play well in hardware mode vs games that are only good in SW. Add to that games that upscale good vs games that will only look okay in native res and I guess we're up to something. I'm thinking about small icons in infobox like compatibility field in Dolphin wiki for ex. (imagine those yellow stars are icons for wide-screen/HW/etc...) (and categories as well). What do you think? --Ngng (talk) 09:24, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

I was actually gonna ask if you could add icons similar to the Dolphin wiki; then I decided not to ask because I didn't want to ask too much. Maybe we can use icons similar to the icons shown in the back of PS2/PS3 game boxes. For example:

I could help make custom icons for different tags and we could ask the forums for additional help. --SHunter 09:56, 1 January 2015 (GMT-5)

Yep, exactly like PS3 icons!.. But I'm a bit swamped with PCSX2-related work now... :-\ I need to refine my test cases transfer (some tasks still remain, no-one else will do them for me), I'm in a process of updating forum compatibility threads (like this) to link them back to the wiki and most notably I need to continue working (correcting) on User:DoctorMuerte/test3, otherwise our Doctor may get slightly offended by my delays... :)
In the meantime you could prepare icons and update infobox template to reflect the changes (with icons ready I could even update it myself it shouldn't take that long). --Ngng (talk) 16:26, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

I made my first rough draft: http://i.imgur.com/o8aKa8V.png What do you think of it so far? --SHunter 11:15, 1 January 2015 (GMT-5)

I was thinking more about small images without text so they could fit anywhere in infobox. Like your screen picture with 16:9 but without "Widescreen support". We can try the icons with words of course but I predict we'll have a hard time trying to fit them anywhere. Although it's your turn to try, why not try with and without words. --Ngng (talk) 18:11, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
Hi guys. Don't worry about the guide Ngng, you're making a lot of work, it will be ready when its ready.
If you guys are gonna work with the infoboxes, I wanted to suggest two things:
  1. Maybe the icons can be placed instead of the game's title. I always though that the name on the infobox was somehow "redundandt" with the page title.
  2. Could we try to set the Playable status with the same green as the region on the test cases?
Something like this
DoctorMuerte (talk) 17:45, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
1. The title is not that useful I agree and it's more of a design choice than a feature. You can try placing some icons in there (temporary on the wiki or virtually in Photoshop) to see how it will look (I'm more inclined towards the space behind the picture though, but it does not matter much until we can see the result).
2. Okay, try it (it's not hidden that deep in templates). I chose the different color because infobox' green was too bright and distracting. Update test template or infobox to see what's the best option we'll also check it out. --Ngng (talk) 18:11, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
You're ninja'd me with icons while I was typing :). That it the place (behind the picture) I was aiming for... --Ngng (talk) 18:11, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
I play too much Shinobido and Red ninja :P. I'm gonna try to do something overnight, do you want me to copy/paste the template to another DoctorMuerte/test4 or do you want me to try to change the template itself? (I can always undo if nesesary). DoctorMuerte (talk) 18:29, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
Do it on the real templates of course. Why wasting time copying things around... --Ngng (talk) 19:00, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

How do these icons look? http://i.imgur.com/k8u8fem.png

Icon key from left to right: Progressive scan, Native widescreen support, Widescreen patch available, and Game does not support widescreens.

I wanna change the progressive scan icon but I'm not sure what to replace it with. Do you guys have ideas for what the other icons should look like?

And what sizes should the icons be? Currently I'm making all these icons as vectors images meaning I can scale the icons however I want without any loss of quality. --SHunter 1:17, 1 January 2015 (GMT-5)

I like the design. A couple of ideas I can think of (I'm not at home so I can't use the pc to make images as example):
  1. You can try to make the blue part of the gradient match any of the blue colors used on the infobox, if not done yet (using the hex code).
  2. Another posibility is having 2 versions of the icons, to differentiate, if the option is available or not. Then we would need 3 icons (with their special version): progressive (available/unavailable), native 16:9 (available/unavailable) and widescreen patch (available/unavailable):
  • Normal version as it is now
  • Grayscale, or darker, or brighter version, to show that the given option is not available
  1. Progressive scan can have arrow tips pointing to the right, and a small p on the botton right corner
  2. 16:9, "widescreen patch", and "no wideecreen patch" can have a line with arrow tips pointing to both sides.
  3. "No widescreen patch" (if used) icon should include the same "tool icon" (dont know its name), so the viewer can easily tell it refers to the fact that widescreen patches aren't available. DoctorMuerte (talk) 22:08, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

The blue used on the infobox is too close to white to be used in the gradient. But if you want the colors to consistent, maybe we can use this color (#14b7fb) in the infobox template.

Personally I don't feel that there should be another icon showing that progressive scan is not available since only a handful of games support progressive scan. Also the last icon isn't meant to show there isn't a widescreen patch, it's meant to show that there is no support for widescreen either natively or via patch. So putting the wrench on it would be "misleading".

Maybe adding a p to the first icon will make it look better.

What other icons would you guys like to see be made? --SHunter 6:30, 1 January 2015 (GMT-5)

Your icons look very good, although in my opinion progressive scan icon is not that useful (only as a flag for the user to switch deinterlacing on I guess). Basically we have two variables here: WideScreen (unknown, no, yes, patched) and Progressive (unknown, no, yes). I vote for adding some kind of "looking-good-when-upscaled" icon and works in HW mode icon. Concerning the sizes you can still upload svg (it should be supported) so the size won't be a problem anymore, otherwise go with somewhat smaller sizes (I'd say at least 3 times smaller) so they won't end up looking bad after downsizing. --Ngng (talk) 09:19, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
Ah, yes... About light-green color for the infobox -- Beatmania IIDX 11: RED. This looks pretty pale. Maybe I'm too used to the old color, I dont really know. Your take? --Ngng (talk) 09:19, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, the lighter color looks unfamiliar. The thing about the #00FF00 color is that it looks too saturated to me, at least compared to the blue tone of the region names. But probably its just my impression so I'd like to hear other user's opinions on this topic. I'm not sure how to make it look better anyway (smoother might be the word). Maybe with another tone (but I think we have too much colors already), perhaps painting only the word Playable, or only painting the status text background (leaving Windows status grey). I have to try different options and make templates of it for easier comparation.
On my user page, I've taken note of the different colors used on the Wiki. I've noticed we have 3 and 4 shades for different colors. Maybe we should consider making a palette of colors that look consistent to be used on all the templates, (probably including the blue tone used on the future widescreen icons, as pointed by SHunter).
DoctorMuerte (talk) 21:53, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
I don't think we should restrict ourselves to a certain color palette or a defined number of "main" colors. Why stop using as many colors as we like if it will look good? Anyway you can try to "unify" all the colors used on the wiki if you like as long as it won't look ugly :)... As for the new infobox color my opinion will stay. I liked prev. version better. It had more distinction. Try lighter shade of 00FF00 maybe as a compromise? --Ngng (talk) 09:13, 3 January 2015 (UTC)

More Tags (cont.)

I can't seem to upload .svg files. It says it's not permitted. Maybe someone has to enable it for the wiki? In the mean time, I'll just upload the png. --SHunter 10:06, 3 January 2015 (GMT-5)

PNGs are fine then. I'd need to bother Bositman to add svg support, but it's not that important so I'd rather not do it. Nice pictures so far! When you upload the rest I'll modify the infobox and add new categories. --Ngng (talk) 10:13, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
About the color, I resetted it to #00FF00 but if I find one that I think looks better I'll propose it. I have the impression the colors could be more consistent with some testing. DoctorMuerte (talk) 00:43, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
Well you can go ahead and change instead of proposing; we will comment on that. Saves time really (hint: if you're modifying regionbox, edit and save infobox also (even without changes), otherwise the real pages will not update). --Ngng (talk) 10:13, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

I polished the icons up a bit. What do you guys think of the new "Widescreen Patched" icon? --SHunter 3:55, 4 January 2015 (GMT-5)

I like both of them, maybe the detail con the screen (skyblue on its bottom right corner) won't show up properly if we use a small scale of the file, but we have to test it first of course. DoctorMuerte (talk) 05:58, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
On a side note, when we determine the proper size of the files, they will look better, bacause you can export them on their right size. DoctorMuerte (talk) 05:59, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
Patched now looks exactly like it should (I mean much better) :) --Ngng (talk) 15:27, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

I made some icons for Interlaced and Progressive: http://i.imgur.com/hT2nn0n.png Although the icons are more of a concept than a rough draft.

Do you guys think I'm going the right direction with these icons or should I design them a different way?


Next I want to make icons for games that look good in HW mode/games that only look good in SW mode. But I have no idea how to design those icons. Any ideas? --SHunter 4:37, 6 January 2015 (GMT-5)

Regarding I/P, you could try to simplify a little (i.e. remove the sun (or don't), and try make the interlace effect more recognizable, like in a movement example here), although I think that design will also be alright, we're not some kind of million users site to try to perfect everything after all.
Upscaled/not upscaled is quite simple: rough pixelated image vs smooth good looking.
HW/SW is harder. Displaying 3D sign vs 2D sign may be or some kind of CPU icon or text vs GPU icon or text, I can't think of anything else atm. --Ngng (talk) 06:04, 7 January 2015 (UTC)


Someone mentioned we should split stubs from games without test entries... I already did something like that. Right here.

I used that on FFX-International I think if I remember right. It creates a different category for the games that still need testing. Link. We can probably update games with that. It would still be a lot of work though.. I think we have higher priorities than that for this Wiki for now. -- Ryudo (talk) 14:09, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Yep, I saw your template (I removed it because the article now has a test case). The thing is: the only man who could put this template in the correct articles is me (otherwise we're looking at a good amount of work by hands), but between other wiki-related tasks and my real-life work (and that freaking DAI that looks endless :-\) I just don't have a time for it right now. Besides I'd like to complete the wiki with all possible PS2 games before doing something like this. So, I guess it will have to wait a bit... --Ngng (talk) 16:24, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Another icon for progressive/interlaced: http://i.imgur.com/gc6j4Mq.png

It's a bit simplistic however instead of using the ball, I could use that moving interlaced effect on another object.

--SHunter 11:26, 7 January 2015 (GMT-5)

Yes the motion interlace is the way. But you should make the strokes bigger so they will still be visible after resize. I modified your example a bit to see how it will look resized (bottom left small image is your original, you can see that the strokes look more like a blur now). --Ngng (talk) 06:24, 8 January 2015 (UTC)
It occurred to me that one game can be progressive and interlaced simultaneously (PAL and NTSC-U regions). What should we use if that is the case (right now we're looking at one icon per page)? --Ngng (talk) 06:37, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

I uploaded the icons for progressive and interlaced. We can always change/improve on the icons later.

According to the wiki there are games that have progressive scan only for the NTSC regions, but there are no games that only have progressive scan for the PAL regions. So we can modify the progressive icon to show that it's only available to the NTSC version of the game.

--SHunter 4:11, 9 January 2015 (GMT-5)

So PAL games always have progressive option (this sounds logical), lets reserve this icon for NTSC-U/J games only then. Some games have multiple editions and even if we'd want to award progressive icon on the region basis some editions (like director's cuts or similar) may have progressive option while others may lack it. So lets not over-think it I guess and leave the basics only: progressive (if any non-PAL edition has it)/no progressive (if any non-PAL edition does not have it). Any other info may go to the game's description. --Ngng (talk) 07:02, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

It has been a while since I worked on the icons, I've been sorta busy :P Anyways, what do you think of the icons for HW/SW: http://i.imgur.com/7GcdTmM.png

It's a lot more clean/minimalistic compared to my other icons. BTW feel free to criticize, I'm trying to improve on my skills. Hearing someone else's perspective really helps.

--SHunter 6:07, 15 March 2015 (GMT-5)

Oh! Good timing! I was just thinking about your idea the other day. The real life is ever so demanding, I know...
This pair is nicely drawn but to be honest I haven't caught their meaning until I read your message fully. I don't think it's a problem though because we will have a tooltip to accompany a picture. I especially like CPU icon. GPU icon is not so obvious, and kinda looks like a "10" symbol (or even "100" in some perspective) (maybe removing the first vertical line may help?).
Anyway, they look fine and ready! --Ngng (talk) 06:12, 16 March 2015 (UTC)
I added color and text to the CPU icon. I think it looks better with color but I'm thinking of removing/changing the text.
http://i.imgur.com/yHLuoR6.png
I'm going to redo the GPU icon from scratch and maybe try to shape it based on an actual GPU.
--SHunter 4:35, 27 March 2015 (GMT-5)
This one also looks nice. Good luck with GPU! I wanted to put those icons in action already but with this server transfer all images disappeared and the only option is to wait for them to return (hopefully not so long)... :-\ --Ngng (talk) 05:28, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

More Tags (cont. 2)

Well I finally finished making the GPU for the icon: http://i.imgur.com/vAqjMuj.png
I wanted to design the GPU after an "open GPU" (e.g. http://cdn3.wccftech.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/vodo.jpg) but it ended up being a lot harder to make than I though it would be.
I think the icon could use a better color scheme; any suggestions?
Also, what icon is next on this list?
--SHunter 1:12, 3 May 2015 (GMT-5)
I still really like the original icons, to be honest with you. There's elegance in their simplicity: http://i.imgur.com/7GcdTmM.png -Karasuhebi (talk) 19:18, 3 May 2015 (BST)
It's awesome that you like the original icons but the problem for me is that the icon for the GPU (on the original set) isn't very good because it hardly looks like a GPU. I decided to use the old icon's "chassis" and make a hybrid with the icon I just made. Here's the result (at the bottom): http://i.imgur.com/fQhsQVv.png
If the icon is still too complex, as a compromise on each game article we can use the simple version of the icon (black and white) and on the category pages we could use the color version.
--SHunter 7:21, 3 May 2015 (GMT-5)
We could definitely use both variants! I too think b&w simple icons will look better downsized inside the infobox. Could you upload them on the wiki as well?
As for other icons of the set, the folks suggested CPU-heavy, GPU-heavy games and/or may be the "perfectly emulated" icon (award). But I really have no idea what would be the difference between HW/SW rendering and GPU/CPU heavy icons. It was hard enough to draw HW/SW...
Additionally I suggested earlier "smoothly upscaled game" icon (in other words "HD graphics now!").
Btw, how come you are still living in March? :) --Ngng (talk) 09:26, 4 May 2015 (BST)
Time flys by so fast, it's still March to me :P
I uploaded the simple versions of the last two icons:
HWmin.png SWmin.png
I kept the gold parts for both of the icons since the GPU icon looked weird without it. I may also make simple versions of the other icons too since the simplified versions will be easier to implement.
I have some ideas in mind for CPU/GPU heavy icons but I don't know if I'll be able to make them the way I imagine it in my head.
--SHunter 6:22, 4 May 2015 (GMT-5)
Nice icons! The best in the series in my opinion. I'm looking forward to test them when I'm back. --Ngng (talk) 09:10, 5 May 2015 (BST)
Those are really nice yeah. I'm a bit wondering about the software one though.. how is that related to software exactly? o_o -- Ryudo (talk) 10:37, 5 May 2015 (BST)
Well, SW rendering was never a perfectly correct term to begin with (both HW and SW modes use software to do the work). CPU rendering and GPU rendering are much more close to reality (imo). --Ngng (talk) 09:11, 6 May 2015 (BST)
Oh right, it's supposed to be a CPU. I still think it's a bit unclear to be honest the way it is now. It would probably be better if you add something like "SW" in a small font somewhere on there. That's just me though. If you guys don't agree with it then you can leave it as is, but I think you should get some input from other people on that one as well. Regardless of it being a correct term or not. (Fact is that most, if not all people go by 'Software' mode rendering and not 'CPU' rendering. -- Ryudo (talk) 11:46, 6 May 2015 (BST)
I think we should use the CPU/GPU as the CPU/GPU heavy icons. So I guess I have to agree with Ryudo, we should just text to indicate which renderer to use.
Here's the icons for games that do/don't scale properly: http://i.imgur.com/6HFpl62.png
Alternately we can use: http://i.imgur.com/FVC4sfB.png (Or use both)
I tried making a pixelated icon and a smooth one but I don't think those icons will scale very well.
--SHunter 8:44, 6 May 2015 (GMT-5)
Well, okay by me! HD/SD are simple an nice (I think we shouldn't use SD, though, one icon is enough). I've just got home and ready to sleep for the next ?? hours. I'll be back. --Ngng (talk) 11:04, 8 May 2015 (BST)

Lets move this conversation to the bottom of this page. --Ngng (talk) 11:35, 10 May 2015 (BST)

Consolidating PCSX2 documentation

Hi ng, I actually posted some info on the forum about what I was trying to do, and Rama and Bositman agreed that it would be a good idea to consolidate all of the wikis into one. http://forums.pcsx2.net/Thread-PCSX2-Wiki-collaboration-thread?pid=425297#pid425297

Ah, okay. But it would be nice to at least format it a bit (I hope you're gonna do it eventually, no fancy stuff but some paragraphs, italics, font sizes, etc...). Besides every page should be at least in one category (just add [[Category:Development documentation]] or something similar to the end of each page). --Ngng (talk) 06:02, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

Advised please?

1. How do i "update" an existing image?

2. Should i remove? {{info-stub}} from pages with enough information.

3. A suggestion, regarding this page: http://wiki.pcsx2.net/index.php/PCSX2_Wiki:Community_Portal

Add a link to "How to contribute page" leading to "Things to do on the wiki" or better yet add it to the left panel. This way it may serve as a task prioritization and status update of the wiki along with "Recent changes" page, so people know where they are needed the most.


Hi!
1. It's pretty easy actually. To update an image just click "Upload a new version of this file" at the bottom of this image page (like this one). Although "Wild Arms 4 .png" was not a good name I agree, we still could "move" it to a better name (to preserve its history of updates).
2. Yes, of course!
3. It's a good idea (community portal is kinda deserted though). Not sure about the left panel (at least yet), but "How to contribute" page could use some changes. You can add it yourself, you know :). If not for my terminal lack of time I'd do many things... :-\ (and I hope I will eventually...)
--Ngng (talk) 08:46, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

4. (from e-mail) Now i have some doubts/quiestion but i don't quite understand how to use "Talk" pages.

You leave a message on my talk page, I see it and I answer. :) There's nothing more to it than that! You did exactly that.
To add your signature use this string ~~~~ at the end of your message. --Ngng (talk) 09:46, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

Is there a norm or guidence to fallow when uploading game covers?

I ask because the user Ryudo has been updating covers like this this Star Ocean: Till the End of Time.

So to keep things consistent and avoid extra work, since we all are contributing to the wiki (and at least i don't have a clue how to set up a bot to do some of the work like you) what's your advised?

The only norm is trying not to upload the copyrighted images (since we obviously do not have the permission for that). It's not that big of a crime but one day it may backfire if original owner will ask to take those images down (miniscule chance for that, but still...). Wikipedia among other similar sites have its images in public domain, so they are safe. Oh, and keep the images names informative (for ex. 123.jpg is not a good name).
Additionally I wouldn't worry about bots. I do not set them up, it's not that easy. I write those bastards from the ground up specifically for one task, so bots can't just be found on the Internet... --Ngng (talk) 06:12, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
Usually I upload higher quality covers or correct wrong ones or to just have a better one than what's already in place, but they come with the back art attached, so I first have to modify them in Photoshop to just get the front cover and also reduce their dimensions. (If you notice, the ones I upload are always one specific size in height and width) Technically you can't really get in trouble for this, because the source would also be in violation of copyright at the same time then, and they wouldn't want to risk that. But we've been at this for so long now, I really doubt there will be any issues. -- Ryudo (talk) 13:32, 22 February 2015 (UTC)

GSdx's texture filtering options

Hey I saw you made a change to the texture filtering option a while back (http://wiki.pcsx2.net/index.php?title=GSdx&diff=311&oldid=310) and I wanted to ask you, what are '3D textures'? I'm still not exactly sure what this option does when it's fully turned on. Here's some screenshot comparisons I did in Final Fantasy XII IZJS: http://imgur.com/a/ZNeuy

When texture filtering is off, you can clearly see the sky looks very pixelated. When you put texture filtering in the middle option (grayed), you can see some improvements. Then when you turn texture filtering all the way on, (where it's supposed to filter '3D textures'), you can clearly see that the text overlay on the bottom-left is being filtered. So what exactly are '3D textures' then?

Thanks! Karasuhebi (talk) 23:20, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

I'm not a PCSX2 developer, all my PCSX2/PS2 knowledge is a combination of common sense and online info. So the following are just my speculations. GS can render textures (a texture is any image) on a surface of 3D object (the sky in your example is a 3D object that surrounds the whole scene and has a cylindrical or elliptical shape with a clouds image drawn upon it, the clothing and face are also "3D" textures). Additionally GS is capable of drawing simple textures do not belong to any 3D object (i.e. sprites). Sprites are often used to paint text/2D models in 2D games (this example is full of sprites drawn on a simple 3D scene); in your case it is was a text.
GSdx can filter textures in both modes, but filtering some 2D games can cause them to look too blurry (or cause visual artifacts) so the developers (Gabest I suspect) decided to leave an option for the users on how they want texture filtering handled (i.e.: no filtering, filter everything or filter only those textures pulled upon 3D objects). I hope that answers your question.
Btw you've made a great example on this. May I use it in GSdx to clarify the feature in question? --Ngng (talk) 06:20, 24 February 2015 (UTC)
Yeah man, totally. Go for it! :) BTW I know you're not a native English speaker but I gotta say...damn! That was a beautifully written explanation/speculation right there! :D
13:01, 24 February 2015 (UTC)
Thanks! I guess I'm improving over the years, strange... --Ngng (talk) 16:46, 24 February 2015 (UTC)
Hey the caption to one of the pictures in the GSdx article is wrong. With the grayed out option, the HUD isn't unfiltered completely. The map itself is filtered, it's the icons on the map that are unfiltered. Look at all three pictures again and you'll see. :) --Karasuhebi (talk) 19:53, 24 February 2015 (UTC)
Ah, yes? Oh... Okay! --Ngng (talk) 21:00, 24 February 2015 (UTC)


New information on GSdx's texture filtering options

Hey I have more accurate info about the different options for Texture Filtering. This is coming from gregory himself so it is as accurate as it can be: 1/ disable every where 2/ force every where 3/ only do it when the PS2 request it.

So basically the grayed option only filters textures that the game itself tells it to filter, which is what the PS2 does. I got the info from here: https://github.com/PCSX2/pcsx2/issues/630#issuecomment-117973274 -Karasuhebi (talk) 18:11, 13 July 2015 (BST)

Okay, then you should change the description, I guess. I heard it differently from somewhere back in the days. It's possible that PS2 could "request" not to filter in case of 2D sprites which is basically what's written in the description right now. Unfortunately I'm not familiar with PS2 on any level beyond pushing power button. (And to be honest PS2 team could use a couple of good dedicated devs these days. GSdx does not get any real updates for years now)... --Ngng (talk) 18:35, 13 July 2015 (BST)
It's actually the game that requests the filtering/not filtering of textures, so if the PS2 is not filtering sprites (no need to say "2D sprites", as sprites are only in 2D) it is because the game told it to turn off filtering for those textures. But yeah, I'll fix the entry. I just thought I'd share it here because I figured you would find it interesting. -Karasuhebi (talk) 16:47, 14 July 2015 (BST)
I still think there's more to it than a game's free will. But you should change the article of course (and look for it in windows guide also, it may contain some similar info). --Ngng (talk) 16:52, 14 July 2015 (BST)
I don't think there is. gregory is our main GSdx developer right now and he's been knee-deep in GS code for months now. I trust that the information he is giving us is completely accurate. Oh I forgot to mention that to you in my last comment. GSdx has been getting real updates lately. gregory has been making some amazing strides for accuracy, specially in the OpenGL renderer. There's going to be a GSdx version bump coming soon, and I would imagine the OpenGL renderer might become the default some time in the future. :) -Karasuhebi (talk) 17:03, 14 July 2015 (BST)
It's nice to be enthusiastic about things. I wish I could do that on a regular basis. Hope you're right about GSdx. --Ngng (talk) 17:15, 14 July 2015 (BST)

Please delete these

Hey ng, can you please delete the following pages:

Thanks in advance. :) -- Ryudo (talk) 17:36, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

Okay, np. --Ngng (talk) 06:13, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

File deletion request

Hey User:Ngng can you please delete these? Thank you!

Also can you delete this redirect page? I made it by mistake.

Sure. Tomorrow when I have time to check them thoroughly. --Ngng (talk) 19:05, 2 March 2015 (UTC)


Thanks!! P.S. If you're wondering where I got those dead files from, it was from our Special:UnusedFiles page. I would suggest going in there and looking around when you're done deleting the images above because there's more unused pictures in there.

Actually, no, I didn't wonder. If you see those files and many dead pages lying around you gotta know it's because I have little time to clean. But periodically I do some housekeeping removing obsolete or dead stuff.
I also wanted to ask you not to rename game article pages by yourself. Most pages are linked to the forum threads and those forum threads are linked back to the wiki. Only moderators can update old forum messages to reflect name changes occurred the wiki. If you find a wrong titled game article (I know there are quite a few of them still), please just drop me a message, I'll correct them in both places. Thanks! --Ngng (talk) 19:05, 2 March 2015 (UTC)
Will do. Sorry about that! --Karasuhebi (talk) 20:12, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

Shin Budokai games still listed in the Wanted Pages page

Do you know why the Shin Budokai games are still showing up in the Wanted Pages special page even though we edited the template?

In my understanding the wiki has slightly incorrect setup on the server. Meaning, it lacks some kind of queue procession (possibly Job queue. For example, changing a template will not automatically update all the pages this template is used on (though these pages will eventually be updated, but quite unpredictably time-wise). I'm probably totally wrong about the reason (I've never fiddled with WikiMedia), but some misconfiguration is evident. --Ngng (talk) 11:48, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
You're definitely not wrong. I have to update a template -and- the page the template is being used on. It's not being live updated. Extremely annoying to be honest and this is the only wiki I'm experiencing this on. That's the same thing occurring with the image updates as well (the whole wiki cache thing not updating right away). I had issues fixing up the /doc page as well because of this problem, because after updating the doc, it still wouldn't appear in the template's documentation until the template itself was updated again as well. -- Ryudo (talk) 14:11, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
So I have to go into each one of these games' pages and edit them for the template to update on those pages? O_O --Karasuhebi (talk) 14:36, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
I think it depends on what's being updated. It doesn't seem to be the case with 'everything,' but it's still happening in some cases. Of course it does update on its own eventually in case it's one of those times where it's not being instantly updated, but in that case you can just force a manual update. -- Ryudo (talk) 15:35, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
Another example: Grandia 2. I made an Ubisoft page, and on the Grandia 2 page, it still shows the link as RED, acting as if the page doesn't exist yet. I have to edit and save Grandia 2 page to make the link have the correct color. (Clicking it takes you to the correct page regardless of link color). -- Ryudo (talk) 15:46, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
As I said the pages WILL update later but in unpredictable manner (sometimes it takes only minutes or hours, but sometimes in rare cases even weeks). To be honest, I never considered this issue to be a big deal. I've never needed an instant update for anything so I just learned to live with it. Besides I think that even Bositman will not be able to solve this, because the problem possibly requires an access to the server itself (to setup scheduler of some sort or such). --Ngng (talk) 15:55, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

Centering Region and OS in TestingEntry Template

Hey NG, I was wondering if you could update the template so that the Region and OS sections of the tables are being centered automatically? It would look a bit neater that way. Not sure if it's possible with the current setup of the template though. I've been doing it manually with the <center></center> tags for my own entries. But if we could update it in the template itself to automatically center whatever text is entered in those sections, it would also update every page to look the same as well. -- Ryudo (talk) 12:09, 15 March 2015 (UTC)

Well, I was kinda hesitant to answer because I'm not sure if I'll like this style better (it subtracts from the table's uniformity), but, oh, well, let's try it, we can always return to the previous state after all. I'll make changes, but I do not know how long will it take for them to appear (presumable a couple of days), we'll see. --Ngng (talk) 17:38, 15 March 2015 (UTC)

Categories for Easy to emulate games, CPU-heavy games, and GPU-heavy games

For you (Ngng) and Ryudo:

http://wiki.pcsx2.net/index.php?title=Final_Fantasy_X&diff=35144&oldid=33853

The change listed above gave me an idea: We should have some way of denoting games that are known to be easy to emulate, games that are known to be CPU-heavy, and games that are known to be GPU-heavy. I think a category would be the best way to do it. We could use the lists already in use in the forums. What do you guys think? --Karasuhebi (talk) 18:32, 21 April 2015 (BST)

That would really work. Dust up the clutter of older and outdated articles.

Dan Castellaneta (Talk) 13:38, 4.21.2015 (CST)

I think it's in line with what SHunter proposed here & here. TLDR: we wanted to add some flags (or icons like these) to be shown in game infoboxes. Those could include wide screen, progressive scan, HW playable, SW only, etc. Then SHunter vanished as he often does and I couldn't gather strength to do something bigger than gaming after coding, coding and more coding... :-\ I guess I needed the full icon set anyway so that was my excuse. --Ngng (talk) 20:50, 21 April 2015 (BST)
The icon system would've been really nice. I saw some of those and they looked pretty awesome. Shame he didn't stick around to finish it. :/ For now as an alternative we can maybe use the categories like suggested here, or we could try and wait for SHunter a bit longer maybe. (Maybe try sending him an e-mail or whatever?) -- Ryudo (talk) 21:18, 21 April 2015 (BST)
I'll be on vacation for the next 2 weeks (starting tomorrow night). It's possible I won't be able to access the Internet. If I'll have the access you'll see me awarding 'ninja' rights to the new users but not doing much else. After the vacation I guess I'll finally start acting somehow (I'm terrible with such promises though :-\ ). So long guys! --Ngng (talk) 19:24, 23 April 2015 (BST)

Just to update you guys: I'm still planning on finishing the icon set but I've been rather busy. Fortunately, starting this month I'll have a bit more free time than usual and starting mid June I'll have even more free time. Sorry to keep you guys waiting; hopefully we can start using icons on the wiki by July. --SHunter 4:24, 2 May 2015 (GMT-5)

Glad to hear it man! :D -Karasuhebi (talk) 02:02, 3 May 2015 (BST)
Unfortunately I know what does it mean to be busy. But we're not on timer here, you know, so take your time! :) (this page took at least a minute to load) --Ngng (talk) 09:08, 3 May 2015 (BST)
Time to start archiving your Talk page? :P -- Ryudo (talk) 10:20, 3 May 2015 (BST)

Time to find better internet. But unfortunately it's not an option here. :) --Ngng (talk) 09:09, 4 May 2015 (BST)

New game properties icons

Please take a look at this page User:Ngng/test1. I think it looks pretty nice but the icons still need some work to be useable at 50x50 res. Currently the template lacks the following icons: HD game (scales perfectly), Perfectly emulated game icon/award, GPU or CPU-only emulated game (i.e. HW rendering in GSDx unusable because of severe glitches) --Ngng (talk) 11:33, 10 May 2015 (BST)

Shunter can probably make downscaled versions for it. A 50x50 source file is fine for this rather than using the enlarged one. That way you can also create clear text for it, since the text doesn't get blurred out from downscaling. As for games that have trouble rendering in HW. You could create a button with a ' / ' through it. Indicating that only software mode works properly. Alternatively you could just not list a GPU button, and only leave the CPU (Software mode) button. I think you should center the buttons btw. -- Ryudo (talk) 18:08, 10 May 2015 (BST)
The icons actually ended up scaling better on the infobox than I thought they would. I can upload the downscaled versions tomorrow (since I can't atm), and we'll see how they look. I'll probably also make a new version of the interlaced/progressive icons tomorrow if I have time.
Also do you guys think the GPU/CPU icon will look better with or without the text?
--SHunter 8:56, 10 May 2015 (GMT-5)
@SHunter: I think it's hard to say what's better without looking (so it's your decision). I'd like to use your "HD" icon as well, but you haven't uploaded it yet.
@Ryudo: You like to center everything, right? :) I tried it centered and preferred left-aligned over it; you can try it yourself, though. Change "left" to "center" and re-save test1 page after that --Ngng (talk) 07:21, 11 May 2015 (BST)
If I may give my opinion: well... better with an image.
By the way, we need to vector the PCSX2 logo (top left corner) and ask Boitsman to change it, I'll work on it to see if I can reproduce it.
DoctorMuerte (talk) 09:05, 11 May 2015 (BST)
Ah, I see that despite my efforts "Windows Status:" still occupies two lines in Linux :-\. Why, oh, why the fonts are so different between the platforms?.. On the side note I taught my Windows to live without ClearType and it looks indefinitely nicer to my eyes than the smoothed-out text, just take a look at the difference. I guess I'll be alone on this but I feel good being able to see each pixel of my monitor! --Ngng (talk) 11:48, 11 May 2015 (BST)
I changed the icon size to 60px because I could barely make out the text at 50px. I took some of DocotorMuerte's advice to fix the icons, thanks for your help. And I still have to fix/upload the other icons.
I made another version of the progressive/interlaced icon and tried to see how it would look on Ngng's test page, and I noticed the icons were touching. I thought it was due to the height, so I accidentally made the those icons look weird and stretched out :P What do you guys think of the progressive/interlaced icons (ignoring the weird flattened look). I would upload the fixed versions but I can't atm...
Ngng could you fix the spacing issue so that the icons aren't touching. In my previous icons there was s 5px margin on each side (extra space)but I decided to make the icons without margins (Since it looks cleaner at smaller sizes). Maybe there should be a 5px space between each icon?
--SHunter 8:56, 10 May 2015 (GMT-5)

I'm really digging the Progressive Scan icon in DoctorMuerte's imgur link. It's more consistent with the 16:9 one. I don't think just having a 'P' is enough for people to figure it out though. Thankfully there's also a tooltip.

Speaking of tooltips, the tooltip for GPU-intensive games says 'video card intensive'. I would switch video card to GPU. -Karasuhebi (talk) 05:30, 12 May 2015 (BST)

I'll add some space between icons so that they won't stick. Video card -> GPU is done.
@SHunter: your "interlaced scan" icon looks more like a grating now to my eyes. I'd honestly prefer the somewhat modified former image. I'll upload my version alongside it just so you see what I mean.
Also the whole icons set should follow one theme to look nice in a colorful infobox, either they are all b&w or they are all bright and lively. I tried b&w and in my opinion they'd look better on some official and bleak corporate site. --Ngng (talk) 19:57, 12 May 2015 (BST)
What's wrong with an official corporate look for the wiki? We want the project to look mature and serious, not some kid's playground. Not saying I prefer the black and white icons, just says looking professional is not bad. For example I don't think the flames on the icons look too professional. But the only one I saw was the one SHunter just posted below, which is the wrong aspect ratio. Do you guys have links to the regular ones with fire on them? -Karasuhebi (talk) 03:13, 14 May 2015 (BST)
Well, nothing's wrong but we shouldn't be talking games then. Game boxarts and screenshots look a bit distractive (and so is the overall blue theme) for a serious site. You can see the preliminary result here. I'm not necessarily against serious look but it just doesn't fit the bright colors we have. --Ngng (talk) 07:32, 14 May 2015 (BST)
Actually, it seems that 60x60 is not possible because one line could only contain 3 icons this way (with only 2 pixels of additional space for each icon). I reduced the width to 55px, sorry. --Ngng (talk) 21:40, 12 May 2015 (BST)
I also uploaded simplified 55x55 CPU icon for you to check (would it be better to have simple and big icons without text or smaller icons with border and captions?). --Ngng (talk) 22:31, 12 May 2015 (BST)
I'm glad you appreciate the colored icons more, personally I'm not a fan of b&w icons/logos. Do you like the modified Interlaced/Progressive icons?
Also I modified the CPU icon to include a flame (instead of adding the "intensive" underneath it). After making the CPU icon I realized it looks much better without text; and because of that I think we should settle with simple big icons without text.
I was thinking that games with progressive scan support, widescreen support, and games that scale properly can get a special icon: http://i.imgur.com/g9IUO6i.png
Also could you add HD.png in the template, and a category page for each icon.
--SHunter 6:30, 12 May 2015 (GMT-5)
New cpu-heavy/gpu-heavy icons are very beautiful, but they are somewhat smaller (in height) than the rest of the set (making GPU fully square is not an option?). Widescreen icon still uses this barely visible white text (16:9). HD is pretty nice and simple. Interlaced icon has one problem: if the ball has been interlaced its gradient coloring should have had distortion on it as well (sorry I couldn't find the right words) and the stripes should have the same heights, right now it does not look like it was interlaced more like something "furry" is going on behind the ball. --Ngng (talk) 08:36, 13 May 2015 (BST)
How about this for the 16:9 button? I noticed the text is still a bit blurry right now. Here's the image with the right dimensions that show up on the actual page (I don't have the source file, so I had to improvise) : Click -- Ryudo (talk) 13:23, 13 May 2015 (BST)
Pretty nice icon in my opinion, but I leave the judgement to SHunter, it's his project. --Ngng (talk) 18:34, 13 May 2015 (BST)
@Ryudo that's an interesting font, what font is it? After seeing your version of the icon I realized drop shadows help make text clearer in low resolutions. So now, the text is easier to see. I'll make the colors darker if the text is still not clear enough.
@Ngng This is the closest I could make the GPU icon square before before it doesn't even vaguely look like a GPU:
It's 'Impact', quite a nice font to use in various scenarios. :D -- Ryudo (talk) 09:53, 14 May 2015 (BST)
GPU-Test.png
We have 3 options: use the icon above, design another GPU icon to be squarer, or increase the width in the template only for the GPU icon.
I fixed the stripe height issue (turns out their wasn't enough pixels to display properly) but I'm not completely sure what you mean by distorting the gradient on the interlaced icon. Should I split up the gradient into stripes and move each stripe alternating to the left and the right?
--SHunter 5:24, 13 May 2015 (GMT-5)
Or the fourth option would be to make all icons a bit smaller for the current GPU icon to feel right at home. Your decision. I left the squared icon in the test infobox for you to see. I think it fits okay.
About gradient: yes that's what I meant. My tongue failed me. It's the only out of place icon now in my opinion. --Ngng (talk) 07:32, 14 May 2015 (BST)
Just to update you guys, I won't be able to work on the icons until June. Also if anyone wants the .svg files just ask.
--SHunter 4:55, 26 May 2015 (GMT-5)
Well, June is around the corner and we have no reason to hurry, so take your time! --Ngng (talk) 06:29, 27 May 2015 (BST)
Btw, when I look on the test page now the icons seem too big to me. Maybe it's just my imagination...
As a summation: we already have widescreen (all 3 icons), progressive + interlased (look a bit odd), gpu-intesive, cpu-intensive (possibly needs to be a tiny bit smaller), HD icon.
What we do not have: sw rendering only and hw rendering supported, perfectly emulated game. --Ngng (talk) 19:19, 29 May 2015 (BST)
Personally I see no need for a 'GPU-intensive' button. It's always going to hit your GPU when you set scaling to higher, and there's only a select few games that are truly heavy on the GPU. If I had to guess I'd say 95% relies on CPU more than GPU. I guess if there's enough space for it you can add it, but if you need space for the HW Rendering/SW Rendering instead, then I'd vote for dropping this one for now. -- Ryudo (talk) 20:18, 29 May 2015 (BST)
Well there's no real harm in having this icon, either. It's not like it will consume any server resources or such. Even if we have only 5 GPU intensive games, why not mark them accordingly? There will always be users with toasters (mobile or laptops) so some unlucky soul may still find this info useful. --Ngng (talk) 11:00, 30 May 2015 (BST)

New place for discussions

It's been brought to my attention that discussions about the wiki (including its use and its editing) should be held here: http://wiki.pcsx2.net/index.php/PCSX2_Wiki:General_Discussions

It'll be a good place to note wiki problems and leave messages for the community. -Karasuhebi (talk) 14:23, 15 May 2015 (BST)

Well, there's also Community Portal which should serve the similar function. Don't you think one place is enough? --Ngng (talk) 17:06, 15 May 2015 (BST)
Oh we could use the Community Portal, that works too. Just somewhere where people know to look to find discussions about what's going on in the wiki. A newcomer joining our community in two-years' time won't know to look in Ngng's Talk page, but he might know to look on General Discussions or Community Portal. The General Discussions suggestion was given to me by a Wiki admin that's being doing this for a while, whom I trust. -Karasuhebi (talk) 05:03, 20 May 2015 (BST)
I personally use Ng's talk page, since he always gets notified when we leave a message here. And since he's the only one with proper access to the Wiki, this is the page to be. (Though I would recommend Archiving your talk page every once in a while. User:Ngng/Archive 1,2,3,etc maybe? :P) -- Ryudo (talk) 19:47, 15 May 2015 (BST)
I understand what you're saying but Ngng isn't the only person that should be privy to conversations that are being held about the way this wiki works. Everyone should be privy to them. -Karasuhebi (talk) 05:03, 20 May 2015 (BST)
That's not really the point though. Everyone can discuss it here just fine. But ng is the only one that can make a difference or implement things. That's why it should be on this page (for now at least) imo. A lot of wikis do it your way, but a lot of wikis also do it the way I described here. Using the Admin's talk pages to discuss changes/implementations. In the end it doesn't really matter to me where it's being done. So either way works I guess. -- Ryudo (talk) 11:02, 20 May 2015 (BST)
I think anyone can use Community Portal just fine, and I'll be totally fine with it. Btw user rights management (i.e. making a ninja of any new user) and page deletion are all my "special" rights.
As for General Discussions page you can create it, fill it will some starting info and make a link from Community Portal. But I'm really struggling to believe that having two similar pages here would be wise. It's not a million user wiki or Wikipedia after all. --Ngng (talk) 19:03, 20 May 2015 (BST)


New game properties icons (cont.)

While waiting for SHunter to finally reappear, I took the liberty to create a comparison page with different icon sizes. I had the suspicion that they look too big and now I'm sure of it. Please take a look at this page. The first infobox has the 55 pixel width icons at their current "native" resolution. The following infoboxes have 40, 35, 30 and 25 px icons accordingly. Talking the size of the infobox itself into account it looks that 55 pixels size is not reasonable. I'd say only the last variant seems to have too small icons but all those inbetween look better than the first. Which one will you prefer, guys? --Ngng (talk) 19:56, 19 June 2015 (BST)

I've decided to commit the changes with 35x35px icons. It's been almost two months already, so...
@SHunter: I'll edit some of your icons if the new resolution will require, but you can finish them anytime you'll be back. --Ngng (talk) 16:21, 2 July 2015 (BST)
The current icons set:
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
{{{text}}}
 

Filling the info

  • widescreen patched games: source cheats_ws.zip. I believe I'll find the time to fill those myself (using the bot hopefully).
  • widescreen native games: source Wikipedia
  • no widescreen games: source unknown
  • interlaced only NTSC: source unknown
  • progressive NTSC: source Wikipedia
  • GPU intensive: source common knowledge probably + forums
  • CPU intensive: source common knowledge probably + forums
  • Nice looking in HD: source common knowledge probably + forums
  • Perfect game: source forums (I'll try to ask people there, there should not be that many such games)
  • SW only games: source unknown (forums?) - I'm marking most of them by simply using wiki search, they'll evolve naturally from there...
  • HW supported games: source unknown (forums?)
I'm back, sorry for the wait (again).
Should I change the icons so they are 35x35px?
Also here's a source to find which games support progressive scan (480p) or has widescreen support (16:9 aspect ratio): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_PlayStation_2_games_with_HD_support
--SHunter 5:07, 10 July 2015 (GMT-5)
Oh, Hi! Welcome back!
That's a nice find! I'll even copy some notes from that page! There aren't so many games with native 480p or 16:9 support it seems.
Well the icon set is in your hands now, if you have time and think they will look better that'd be wonderful to recreate them in 35x35. (I will only update the "perfect game icon" and stop tinkering with them) --Ngng (talk) 07:26, 11 July 2015 (BST)
A small comment: it's weird but a simple resize gives a better quality "16:9" than a different font size you used: left one is resized (Don't want to nitpick, just commenting). --Ngng (talk) 16:24, 14 July 2015 (BST)
The one on the right seems to be shrunk down further than the one on the left by about 1 or 2 pixels. That might've caused the extra blurriness on the font. Normally there's no way it should look better just resizing it without fixing the text. (Fonts always get blurred) -- Ryudo (talk) 05:31, 16 July 2015 (BST)
Most fonts are a bunch of vectors, so it is up to software how to rasterize it. Resizing bigger rasterized image will often result in better looking smaller image. That's the principle of FSAA. I'm okay with the current image, I was just commenting on it. --Ngng (talk) 17:59, 17 July 2015 (BST)


Sorry for the delay. I really want to help out but I just can't find the time. I decided to upload the sources to the icons, that way someone else could also help make icons: https://mega.nz/#!T51AXaDB!fxeIdVRHxcauVeUkEanpxzzqArpVc3jieE8RbVQXDIU

Also for the "SW Only" and "HW Supported" icon maybe we can use this picture of ratchet: http://i.imgur.com/FUsssw1.png

and the same picture pixelated: http://i.imgur.com/3ll0vAq.png

The original source for the picture is here: http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/4246/rac10.png


I have some ideas for other icons we can make that I was saving to discuss until after I was done with the current set of icons (but that might not be for a while). So I'll just list them here for now:

  • Games that support surround sound (or other advanced audio setups)
  • Games that have offline multiplayer (maybe separate icons to show how many players are supported)
  • Online Multiplayer
  • LAN Multiplayer support
  • Games that have earned the "Greatest Hits" title
  • Support for accessories (maybe separate icons for different accessories e.g. Eye Toy, Steering Wheel, Mic...)

And finally, here's another source we can use: http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/ps2-info-list-of-lists-online-gh-hdtv-surround-sound-etc.50920385/

--SHunter 5:41, 21 July 2015 (GMT-5)

Ratchet looks definitely better than my Utah teapot (I took it here just in case) but could he be copyrighted (especially if it was a part of a boxart picture)? If it's free let's try him out.
As for the other icons -- the more the merrier. I'll add all of those if you give me the icons.
Unfortunately LAN support for PCSX2 was never properly finished and we still lack Eye Toy and Mic support (I'd definitely play Lifeline on PCSX2). --Ngng (talk) 06:48, 22 July 2015 (BST)


So I finally found some time to make some more icons :P

Although I'm still struggling to make an icon to show games that don't work well with hardware rendering. This was probably my best attempt:

--SHunter 3:15, 24 Dec 2015 (GMT-5)


You're back! I can't believe it! :) I mean, it's been a while this time. I added some new icons to the wiki but I think you've seen them already. And I kinda lack time these day (I only start my robot periodically).
You definitely have some out of the box vision, but I still think these new icons are too complex comparing to current simple ones. Try them to see how will they look, or line them up with the current icons, so that we can compare. --Ngng (talk) 22:37, 24 December 2015 (UTC)

General discussions

Posted something on general discussions that I want you guys to chime in on. Thanks! -Karasuhebi (talk) 08:06, 19 July 2015 (BST)

Moujuutsukai to Oujisama

I've stumbled upon game FAQs serial error which took me almost 40 min to untangle. It's getting harder and harder as if re-releases like "Monster Trux Extreme: Arena Edition" -> "Monster Trux Arenas: Special Edition" were not enough... It looks easy when you collect all of them like this (but it's a real adventure to solve the mystery of wrong serials):

I hate SingStar, not only it pushes tasteless, soulless commercial music (okay, maybe along with more decent music sometimes, but it's still buried in "hits"), it's also almost impossible to collect and link all European names of myriads SingStar releases. I always work with assumption that the Wiki has all the titles already created. Just take a look at the leftovers:

  • SingStar Afrikaanse Treffers
  • SingStar Clásicos
  • Singstar ESKA: Hity na Czasie
  • SingStar Italian Greatest Hits
  • SingStar Kent
  • SingStar Miliki
  • SingStar Morangos com Açúcar
  • SingStar Operación Triunfo
  • SingStar Pop 2009
  • SingStar Pop Hits: 40 Principales
  • SingStar Sjung med Disney
  • SingStar Svenska Stjärnor

Typo in the Editing page's text. Where do we fix it?

In the Editing page for this wiki, there's an error in the first sentence. In the first instance where it should say CAPTCHA (Completely Automated Public Turing test to tell Computers and Humans Apart) it says "catcha". Check it out: http://i.imgur.com/HkAfXpk.png

Where do we edit that text?

-Karasuhebi (talk) 00:21, 14 September 2015 (BST)

My bad, thanks! Please check the whole text again just in case. I'm prone to errors and typos. --Ngng (talk) 06:09, 14 September 2015 (BST)
Looks good now. Thanks man! -Karasuhebi (talk) 07:36, 14 September 2015 (BST)

BT3 CPU-intensive?

What's with this edit? http://wiki.pcsx2.net/index.php?title=Dragon_Ball_Z:_Budokai_Tenkaichi_3&diff=37866&oldid=37623

I don't see BT3 on the list of known CPU-intensive games: http://forums.pcsx2.net/Thread-LIST-The-Most-CPU-Intensive-Games

Am I missing something? -Karasuhebi (talk) 20:03, 3 October 2015 (BST)

I was using only pages comments when marking cpu-intesive games, you can remove marks if you know them to be incorrect. Thanks for the list! I'll take a look at it when I'm done with redump.org. (You can also mark the games from the list yourself if you want). --Ngng (talk) 20:16, 3 October 2015 (BST)
Ohhh I see. That makes sense. I thought you were using that list from the forums. That's the one everyone knows. XD
Have you been paying attention to which games you mark as intensive based on the page comments though? Maybe someone who says the game is intensive is using a Pentium 4 or something lol. -Karasuhebi (talk) 20:58, 3 October 2015 (BST)
Yeah, anything is possible (not P4, though, I'd skip it right away): many comments aren't very descriptive. And I'm not a forum dweller, you know... :-\ --Ngng (talk) 21:14, 3 October 2015 (BST)

All the AKAs

Why are you adding all of these Japanese AKAs and such for games? Are they important in any way? I can sort of understand adding the serials, but the names? -Karasuhebi (talk) 21:37, 8 October 2015 (BST)

For the purpose of the wiki they aren't that important I agree, but for the bigger goal of having PS2 games database they are pretty important. And if you'd ever try to find some information on a rare game you'll find them most useful. --Ngng (talk) 06:38, 9 October 2015 (BST)
Fair enough; that makes sense. But shouldn't that be in a separate wiki then? One dedicated to PS2 games instead of PCSX2? -Karasuhebi (talk) 07:17, 9 October 2015 (BST)
Are they that annoying to you? :) I use them to link to other databases' titles with new serials. Besides without them someone who has PAL This is Football 2005 may not find a proper page to update the test info (World Tour Soccer 2006). --Ngng (talk) 08:39, 9 October 2015 (BST)
They're not annoying to me, I just don't see the point in them being on this wiki. As far as your example of someone with a certain version of a game with a different title not finding the proper page to update, that's what redirects are for. No need to clutter the wiki just for that. -Karasuhebi (talk) 20:59, 9 October 2015 (BST)
Well, and what's the purpose of this wiki then? And who defines the purpose of this wiki? I don't see the point in arguing about such trivial matters. The AKAs are needed, without them it will not be possible to collect all the info from the web. --Ngng (talk) 21:07, 9 October 2015 (BST)

16:9 Button

Just something that bothered me about the current button. It's somewhat difficult to see the 16:9 on it. Looks a bit off. I made a different version of it. (I can freely alter the color of the text if necessary).

Your input on it?

Linkage -- Ryudo (talk) 22:20, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

I agree that original icon has rough looking digits at this resolution, but we need two icons of this kind, right (patched and not patched)? Try the second one with no wrench on it, you'll see that your digits look too small (my opinion). --Ngng (talk) 06:18, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Oh right, forgot about the unpatched one. Here's two more.

16:9, no Patch 16:9, Patch -- Ryudo (talk) 10:49, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

These are much better in my opinion. As SHunter disappeared again (who knows for how long this time), go ahead and change the originals. --Ngng (talk) 11:41, 2 November 2015 (UTC)
Gotcha. I uploaded them. (Made a minor change to increase the sharpness a bit on the fonts). Valkyrie Profile 2 page Here you can see how it looks now on the actual page. Looks pretty good I'd say for now. -- Ryudo (talk) 14:28, 3 November 2015 (UTC)


Ongoing replace/automation work

  • Set page playability statuses according to new test cases (Category:Temp new test case, Category:Temp new test case too long)
  • Sort test entries (new test entries were inserted at the top of test tables). Such a work can possibly only be done by hands and it is pretty time consuming.
  • Finish adding Japanese names (take 1) / clear Japanese names of html codes (&reg; remains)
  • Use Game faqs to create still missing titles, serials, release dates, AKAs. I'd even get boxarts from them but I'd need their permission for that. So no luck here I guess.
  • Update the following info: genres, multiplayer status, developers/publishers, special controllers from game FAQs, www.jp.playstation.com
    • Ongoing update: game FAQs: controllers, descriptions, ratings.
    • Many descriptions are still missing, should be updated from Wikipedia in the future.
    • Ongoing update: genres, multiplayer status, developers/publishers, Metacritics links from game FAQs
    • Build the full list of articles without verified descriptions (either with no description at all or with description added by someone else, which should be verified). Many of such unverified descriptions contain only useless basic info from Wikipedia.
  • Check for disabled and removed regions (should not be many left).
  • Renew Japanese names using new serials (take 2) / find Japanese games that game FAQs does not have (currently I known of only one such title)
  • Update the following info: game descriptions from game FAQs with their permission. They gave me the permission to use game descriptions and box-arts on the basis that either comes from the publishers (although AFAIK uploaded by the users so I'll still credit the users involved). What can I say, mighty nice of them! (Dolphin wiki has all the descriptions copied from game FAQs), or Wikipedia if not possible.
  • Automatically set Wikipedia links (where possible) -- not that hard
  • Ask game FAQs permission to use their box arts. (submitted by users, btw), try to use Wikipedia's box arts if not possible. No answer to my messages. :-\
    • Build a list of articles without images or with bad quality images (low-res, small size)
  • Game properties
    • Update widescreen=1 statuses, using pretty chaotic *.pnach database (hard), decide if splitting widescreen=1&2 to widescreen & widescreenpatch is needed
    • Update perfectly-emulated=1 and scales-properly=1 statuses (ask forum users)
    • Online/LAN games: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_PlayStation_2_online_games
    • Other properties? (will need icons from SHunter)

Things are becoming somewhat messy now...

Not sure if you're aware, but your bot or automated program is adding double descriptions to pages that already have proper game descriptions. (In some cases it's the exact same description). You should probably have it check if a description is already there, and just ignore those pages if there is one. -- Ryudo (talk) 16:32, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, I know. I'm checking every edit after the robot and correcting accordingly. The one you found was on it's way to be corrected :). Thanks for the heads up anyway. --Ngng (talk) 16:43, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

Removing TOCs?

I just noticed this: http://wiki.pcsx2.net/index.php?title=Final_Fantasy_X&diff=44920&oldid=44919

Why are you removing TOCs? Those are useful; they help in navigating the pages so people can get to the section they're looking for faster. If you think they clutter the page, then at least do something like what PGW does where they hide the TOC unless you choose to show it: http://pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Glossary:Vertical_sync_(Vsync)

-Karasuhebi (talk) 08:03, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

TOCs are useful only on pages with lots of text, otherwise they are just a clutter... When you can see at least 30% (and even 20%) of page space on your monitor there's no need in TOC. Game pages have enough information already to add some questionable features. Besides we couldn't add TOC to one game page without also adding it to all games pages because they should be uniform. --Ngng (talk) 10:11, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
In the case of that FFX page though... they weren't cluttering. It was actually helpful on that one with the absurd amount of issues being listed. -- Ryudo (talk) 14:52, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, kind of agree, but I really didn't want to make this page special and different from all the others. Maybe later I'll make floating TOC using small font, so that it will not be so obstructive. There shouldn't be more than a couple of such pages though. --Ngng (talk) 15:51, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
When will you get around to implementing a TOC to the pages? I just found another issue caused by not having them: It makes it harder for me to link to specific sections of the page when trying to help a user troubleshoot a problem. -Karasuhebi (talk) 03:19, 7 December 2015 (UTC)
You can link to any H1, H2 or H3 sections with or without TOC by adding #Section_Name at the end of the page link (albeit it's more of a hassle without TOC I agree). Even when I make a small TOC it will not appear on every page automatically and should be added to those pages need it. If you want it so much, you can speed it up by finding a smaller closed-by-default TOC somewhere on the internet and add it yourself (I'll check it later). --Ngng (talk) 06:38, 7 December 2015 (UTC)
Yes, I'm aware you can do that. That's why I said it makes it harder, not impossible. I'm not much of a wiki guy so I doubt I'll find something useful, I just wanted to make sure this was still in your to-do. -Karasuhebi (talk) 08:38, 7 December 2015 (UTC)
I'll get to it after I'm done with ongoing updates. --Ngng (talk) 08:51, 7 December 2015 (UTC)

PAL Serial remove reason

Because I wasn't aware you could put two entries. So I went with the more common one (The NTSC version). :P Now that I know how that line works I can just add onto it if one is already there. -- Ryudo (talk) 16:45, 29 December 2015 (UTC)